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Flint could once again be key to the future of point guard at Michigan State

 Watts_mediumDick Weiss of the New York Daily News is only the latest columnist to touch on what has become a familiar topic over the last four years or so of Michigan State basketball: the "where is the leadership?!" meme.

The reality is, these columns are always inevitably talking about the point guard position. Kalin Lucas and Korie Lucious are talented players, even if both have a few noticeable flaws in their game. Their biggest crime, it seems, is something that isn't going to change: neither guy is Mateen Cleaves.

It has been unfair to Lucas, in particular, to constantly be compared to the greatest leader of the Tom Izzo era. But it should also be clear by now that Cleaves-like leadership and toughness are just not in the cards for Lucas. The present of the point guard position at Michigan State should involve being realistic about the strengths and weaknesses of Lucas and Lucious, allowing each to play to their strengths, and seeking the floor leadership and intangibles from other positions on the team.

The future of the position though? There's a simple solution for Izzo if he's seeking a potential leader in the mold of Cleaves: look no further than Flint, Michigan.

Star-divide

Now, full disclosure, as a Flint resident, I do have a certain affection for Flint athletes. Eric Woodyard of the Flint Journal put it best when describing what makes guys who make it out of Flint special:

That’s how we Flintstones roll. We support those trying to make it, rep hard, and we’re confident in our abilities. It can be described as having that "dog" in you. Take Mateen, for example, fighting through that ankle injury in the 2000 National Championship and still leading his troops to victory or (Mark) Ingram gaining more yards after the contact on the football field. That "dog" wasn’t put in them overnight, it was something that was put in them as children from their environment. I understand that it’s a grind to make it from our city, and that only the strong survive.

But that affection aside, the 2012 and 2013 classes should see Flint once again produce a significant number of Division I college basketball recruits, and two point guard prospects in particular are among the best in the state.

Here's a little breakdown of each guy:

Monte Morris, sophomore, Flint Beecher

I covered a lot of Beecher's games last year with Morris starting on the varsity team as a freshman. A few things that stuck out about him immediately were his confidence, his command of the offense and his defense.

Montemorris_medium
Having a point guard that loves to play defense should, of course, be the biggest appeal of Morris to MSU. He currently plays for a coach in Mike Williams who might be the best on-ball defense coach in the state at the high school level. Beecher consistently produces guards who get after it and move their feet extremely well, and Morris is no different.

In fact, Morris is the rarest of species: I caught him playing lockdown defense for his AAU team, and as most who have been to AAU tournaments know, defense is rarely spotted in that setting. Morris, who plays for Team Detroit, along with Beecher teammate Antuan Burks, completely shut down the opposing guards in the second half of a title game last summer and helped their team erase a 20-point deficit to win their age group.

Last season, Morris had his breakout game against Class C powerhouse Saginaw Buena Vista. As a freshman facing BV's talented backcourt of George Goodman (one of the top scorers in the state) and Devante Jackson (brother of former Notre Dame standout Tory Jackson), Morris scored 29 points and helped Beecher close the gap in the second half in a game they were losing big, although BV eventually prevailed.

It wasn't the point total that was impressive, however. It was the fact that Morris only needed 15 shots to get his 29 points, incredible efficiency for a high school guard. When I asked Mike Williams after the game about Morris' performance, Williams was actually shocked that Morris had scored that many points:

"We still got on him (Morris) for passing up shots," Williams said. "He's the most unselfish kid I've ever coached, and he's our best scorer. He doesn't have to put up a lot of shots to score big. He likes to share the ball, and sometimes I think he's unselfish to a fault. He's capable of scoring 30 or 40 points a night when he's shooting the ball, but he's gotta put the shots up."

Morris led last year's Beecher team, which only had one senior, all the way to the state Class C semifinals, where they lost to Melvindale and Mr. Basketball finalist Michael Talley III. Talley had a huge game in that loss, and Morris learned something from it:

"I take like two days a week to re-watch that game just to take stuff out of his (Talley’s) game," Morris said. "Just how he reads the court, scores and how aggressive he is. That’s really what I’m trying to add into my game."

Morris, who is still on the skinny side, will have to get stronger to hold up at a high major. Right now, however, he's extremely long-limbed, suggesting he might get taller by the time his high school career is over. Morris is currently averaging more than 17 points per game, including 21 points in a recent close loss to Detroit Consortium, the No. 1 ranked team in Class C.

His basketball IQ is on par with any high school player in the state, and the confidence, defensive intensity and intelligence he plays the game with, as well as his hunger to get better (several Flint area coaches have said that Morris is the hardest working player at any Flint area school) would all make him excellent fits with a Tom Izzo-coached team.

Denzel Watts, sophomore, Flint Carman-Ainsworth

Watts is a much different style point guard than Morris in both build and game, but he's also displayed intelligence beyond his years starting for Carman-Ainsworth the past two seasons.

Watts' experience as a freshman was much different than Morris'. While Morris was forced into a primary role on a very young team, Watts won a starting job on a team that featured four seniors who are all playing college basketball somewhere right now. Watts also shared point guard responsibilities with Glenn Cosey, a senior last year who also was primarily a point guard. Both players spent time with the ball in their hands initiating the offense and at other times played off the ball on the wing.

As a result, Watts picked his spots last season, often deferring to his more experienced teammates. Although C-A was certainly talented a year ago, it was clear that Watts was often their most efficient player.

Carman-Ainsworth had been known as the most talented Flint area team over the last few years, but also known for playing down to competition and losing to inferior teams. Last season in the district playoffs opener against Grand Blanc, C-A was on the verge of blowing a double-digit lead late when Watts took the reins of the team. His coach, Bob Root, had more confidence with the ball in Watts' hands than any of his seniors:

"He's got great poise for a young person," Root said. "He just has a certain basketball IQ that most, even seniors, don't have. That, along with his skills, make him a very tough player."

Watts' muscular build and unflappable nature at point guard have caused some to even compare him to Cleaves, including Scout.com last year:

Watts has a lot in common and is already being compared to another former Spartan and Flint native Mateen Cleaves. Like Cleaves, Watts is also a football standout at quarterback and has grown fond of working out.

"Cleaves was able to accomplish a lot and for me to only be a freshman it is an honor to be compared to him," said Watts.

Now, there are obvious differences in their games as well. Watts is not yet the tenacious defensive player that Cleaves was. Offensively, however, he's probably more advanced as a scorer than Cleaves was in high school. Watts has 3-point range and uses his body exceptionally well in traffic. He's a good mid-range shooter and able to stop on a dime to pull up with an effective floater in traffic that is very accurate and is hard to block.

Watts has transitioned nicely from role player last year to primary player this year. With C-A hit hard by graduation, Watts is averaging 20 points per game, up nearly 10 per game over last season. Watts, who plays for the same AAU team as Morris, also has the added value of having the size and versatility to play off the ball as well as handle the point guard responsibilities.

There are certainly other point guard prospects both in-state and out-of-state that Michigan State will consider, but if Izzo is looking for a tough-as-nails leader to plug into that position, both Watts and Morris are smart kids who have been raised in the Flint basketball tradition and already display some of the toughness, talent and intangible qualities that many of the best players Flint has produced over the years showed during their high school and college careers.

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Sounds like either one would be quite a snag

Great analysis. Not sure if you remember me Patrick, but I was in the social media class with you over the summer. Good to see you writing at one of the best blogs in the business.

Adam

by steinfi2 on Jan 24, 2011 11:46 AM CST reply actions  

Spinoff?

With all of the hoops recruiting updates from patrick and Josh, is there recruiting blog spinoff in the works?
If so, you’d have at least one faithful reader. I love it.
Nothing like the promise of the future .

In the nearer term, I’m interested to see if Travis Trice can fill some of that void. As a coach’s kid, I’m banking that he at least plays with more discipline than Kasual Korie and I wonder if he might steal some minutes.

Thanks for the post.

Everybody Loves Draymond

by spartyball on Jan 24, 2011 2:33 PM CST reply actions  

I think his summer routine and improved strength will be the big issue

But my bet is that Trice will contribute as a freshman and be a nice surprise in this class.

"And how much are intangibles worth? 10%? 20%?" - kj@theonlycolors

by intrpdtrvlr on Jan 24, 2011 2:41 PM CST up reply actions  

Agree

People are selling Travis a little short in this class. I honestly think he’s going to be the second most productive incoming frosh behind Dawson. He’s really raised his game this year and that game a week ago against a strong Whitney-Young team (30, 8 and 5 dimes) really opened a lot of eyes.

http://www.ohiohshoops.com/2011/01/huber-heights-wayne-vs-whitney-young-il.html

Korie better really work on his game the rest of the season and over the summer because I have a feeling that TT isn’t going to show up in the fall as your normal nervous, underdeveloped freshman.

by LickSplickidy on Jan 24, 2011 4:36 PM CST up reply actions  

edit...

that was supposed to be 8 dimes and 5 boards. I also like the sounds of his athleticism as he’s finished a couple breakaways in recent games with DUNKS not layups. I like that.

by LickSplickidy on Jan 24, 2011 4:38 PM CST up reply actions  

Dunks Rule

It bugs me that KL and KL2 can dunk but dont.

by Loneytunes on Jan 25, 2011 2:06 AM CST up reply actions  

Great post...

As a fellow Flint area kid who played in some of the same gyms as the Flintstones (though not at the same time), I have a similar affection for Flint players. However, I do wonder if we all (myself included) set ourselves up for disappointment in comparing players to Cleaves. First of all, Mateen was such a skilled athlete that he probably could have played corner in the NFL had he chosen that route. He was an elite talent in football as well as hoops. Mateen was a once in a program player. Conversely, while a great leader, he had help in that department from Antonio Smith the first three years. Smith was one of the few people Cleaves could be intimidated by, though not often. Bell was also a natural leader in a different way. I would love to see more kids from Flint at MSU-there is a toughness they often bring that can’t be denied. But I cringe when people say the next Cleaves is coming. There was only one Mateen.

by rook34 on Jan 24, 2011 2:54 PM CST via mobile reply actions  

In my defense ...

I didn’t compare either kid to Cleaves myself. Some others have written that Watts reminds them of Cleaves because of their builds. I actually don’t see it much, outside of physical similarities. Denzel has more of the Bell type personality — he’s a definite work ethic/lead by example kind of kid at this point. Cleaves was fiery and vocal dating back to his high school days.

And I agree with you that there has been a tendency to over-hype and over-compare Flint kids to some of the greats of the past. I’m not trying to do that in this case. Both of these kids are legit prospects who are getting high major interest. MSU has already been out to watch Morris, in particular, a few times.

by patrick_hayes on Jan 24, 2011 3:10 PM CST up reply actions  

Was directing the comments more in general

To all Spartans, myself included. Sorry if it came across a different way. It’s a tribute to Cleaves and how truly remarkable a player and unique a personality he was (and still is).

by rook34 on Jan 24, 2011 3:14 PM CST via mobile up reply actions  

I for one

am sick of lead by example types. Cleaves, Walton and Neitzel. THATS what we need, I like Kalin Lucas but unfortunately he can’t lead.

by Loneytunes on Jan 25, 2011 2:11 AM CST up reply actions  

In the fourth paragraph

the one just before the break, you say, “If he’s seeking a potential leader in the mold of Cleaves”. I’m pretty sure that qualifies as a Cleaves comparison. :) I never use emoticons but made an exception in this point so it’s clear I’m not trying to be a jerk.

Also, I personally think there’s anything wrong with comparing guys to Cleaves, and I don’t think it sets the bar immesurably high. He was a great college player, but he wasn’t the next Magic or Jordan or Bird. He really wasn’t even as good as Ty Lawson when it comes down to it, at least not on offense. Or Carmello Anthony.

We love him here because he was a part of a special era, and he was an excellent player – especially defensively – but he didn’t have talent exceeding what you might expect to find in any four star recruit, provided you get a little lucky. He did have great intangibles, but again, it’s not unheard of to find those in other players (e.g. Tyler Hansbrough) who have very good talent. My point – and I love the guy and wouldn’t have traded him for anyone – is that if you can lay aside the sepia toned memories, he’s still a fantastic player and leader, but not a once-in-a-generation level one.

by TheCrestedHelm on Jan 25, 2011 9:00 AM CST up reply actions  

I also wonder

how a player with Cleaves’ offensive stats would be viewed by the modern MSU fan base. Cleaves shot 31% from 3 for his career and posted a TO% of 27%+ in 3 of his 4 years as a Spartan.

An all-time great who came to MSU at exactly the right moment in the program’s development, but not quite as flawless as me might remember.

(Also goes under the “food for thought” category—not anything directly related to Patrick’s post.)

Fight for The Only Colors: Green and White!

by KJ@theonlycolors on Jan 24, 2011 3:40 PM CST up reply actions  

I always thought he was a flawed player

However, bad stats can’t undo a legend.
He’s the player that started all of this.
He’s the reason we all act so evil when the team loses now. Expectations.
He always seemed to be in control even if his jumper was a bit wayward.
His best performance to me was a game he didn’t even play in, the win at UNC. That was leadership! That also means the team was pretty good too.
OK that’s enough tribute.

Maybe salvation can be found in another Flint PG but 2013 is too far away for me.
We need a hero now. Or at least next season.

Everybody Loves Draymond

by spartyball on Jan 24, 2011 8:27 PM CST up reply actions   1 recs

No Tone, No Cleaves.

Antonio Smith deserves at least a co-mention as the player that started all this. Smith remains the standard for Spartan rebounding, toughness, and all-around badassery.

Cleaves was the leader, people were (and still are) just naturally drawn to the guy. But he had a lot of help in that department.

by rook34 on Jan 24, 2011 9:55 PM CST up reply actions  

Monte Morris

Im a big fan from what I’ve seen and heard of him. He can score, he’s vocal and he is unselfish. He’s my first choice for 2013. I hear a lot about Cha Cha Tucker but he sounds like a project to me. We have two spots I want Jabari Parker and Morris. That’d be a great group to bring in and would provide a solid base for the future. I think maybe Parker is expendable for a talented big.

One thing Id like MSU to focus on more is getting explosive bigs. Never really was a part of the style and Roe didnt pan out but I think thats the type of player we need since most our recent bigs have been too soft or simply not good. Really Paul Davis was our last great front court player who was physical AND talented (No Suton doesnt count, he was a respected presence but he didnt dominate the paint)

by Loneytunes on Jan 25, 2011 2:19 AM CST reply actions  

Paul Davis

Did you just say Paul Davis was the last physical big man we have had? BWAHAHAHAHA! Shows how much you know about basketball! He was great too? Wow! Paul Davis was one of the softest players I have ever seen in college basketball. I have never seen a 6’11" guy fade away and double clutch as much as him.
I will agree with you however that I like the Parker kid from Chicago, he looked great against Dawson in that HS game. This Morris kid I have not seen but he sounds like the kind of player that Izzo needs to get back to recruiting.

by TBanger on Jan 25, 2011 4:00 PM CST up reply actions  

Cleaves in High School

Watts is a great player but Cleaves could score at will in high school. Many people forget just how good he was. After the accident that broke his back, he was not quite the same player. Although still REALLY good.

And his stats don’t account for all the intangibles that he brought to the table.

And Paul Davis was a good front court player, but people tend to forget how unmotivated he was. He’d pick and choose which games to show up in. He could have been absolutely amazing which is what is frustrating about him.

No, Antonio Smith wasn’t statistically special, but a complete badass. Looking at numbers rarely tells you much about who the real player is.

It’s like ESPN. They will throw out a stat like xyz team is 10-0 when player xyz scores 20 points or more per game. So therefore you must let player xyz get 20 points in order to win. Correlation does not imply causation.

In this Sportscenter world we have become so stat heavy. You want Cleaves running this team with his less than stellar stats or Lucas? I would take Antonio Smith as a sophomore over Sherman and Nix at this point too.

Andre Hutson had limitations and used to piss me off at times. Charlie Bell would just be a lock down defender and be afraid to shoot at times. Neitzel couldn’t score unless it was off ball screens. Ager (my favorite), awesome player, but not a leader.

I don’t know what my point was.

Statistics or not, you’ve watched these players play. You can decide from just watching who the best was.

But it does seem that for MSU we have an overabundance of guys with little confidence or whatever problems they are. Summers, Morgan, Davis, Marquise Gray, Nix, Allan Anderson. I do believe that are quick subbing style, which we have done since the beginning of time, probably doesn’t help. 1 mistake and guys are back on the bench.

Hoping these young guys coming up have confidence and maturity to go with big talent. And we need someone else who can evaluate big men because I don’t think Izzo does a very good job of that.

by st8grad on Jan 25, 2011 9:50 AM CST reply actions  

I can't believe Lucas needs defending at this point

but apparently he does. This year is something of a disappointment, but I don’t think we can really lay the blame primarily on Lucas given his injury situation. Look at the guy’s resume please: Big Ten Player of the Year as a sophmore. Two straight regular season Big Ten titles, including one outright title. Two straight Final Four appearances, one including an appearance in the National Championship game. And yet he’s not a good enough leader?

You guys all need your heads checked. We’re in the midst of the second-greatest era of the Izzo years (so far) and you want to cast blame because were not quite as good as the first great era. Lets just all take a step back and appreciate where we are as a program and how lucky we are to be here. Even with a total flameout this year we’re looking at one of the most successful playing groups in the program’s history. Apparently that isn’t good enough for some of us, but I myself prefer to accentuate the positive.

by TheCrestedHelm on Jan 25, 2011 11:34 AM CST reply actions   1 recs

I think it is more a sense of how frustrating this year has been

This years team is so hard to watch it is by far the most difficult team to watch since Izzo took over, although the Davis years were pretty close. It is plays like the Korie Lucious fast break layup against Illinois (I believe) where he had a fast break layup and looked back to see the defender coming and he still went up half assed and half speed and got his shot pinned on the backboard! He should have sat the rest of the game, he did nothing positive the rest of that game.

by TBanger on Jan 25, 2011 4:06 PM CST up reply actions  

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