Seniors Say Goodbye, Underclassmen Say Hello: Michigan State 85, Iowa 66
by KJ@theonlycolors on Mar 2, 2011 10:05 PM CST
in Michigan State Spartans Basketball
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PrintThings didn't go quite according to script tonight, as the three seniors combined for only 4 points in the first half. Instead, it was the younger guys who kept MSU in the game early and then contributed to building a halftime lead. For the game, the four underclassmen combined for 42 points, led by Keith Appling with 18 points on 4-5 three-point shooting. Meanwhile, Adreian Payne put up 8 points and 6 rebounds with some very active play down low, Derrick Nix scored 9 points on 5-5 free throw shooting (!!!!!), and Garrick Sherman posted 7 points on several nice finishes around hoop.
Substitute Austin Thornton's 7 points for Sherman's, and you get that same 42-point figure--a downright whopping total for bench production in the context of this MSU basketball season. Delvon Roe added 4 assists for his part.
All those contributions helped compensate for Kalin Lucas's slow start and Draymond Green's foul trouble (someone needs to hypnotize Green so he thinks he has 4 fouls when the game starts). Lucas did recover to put up 17 points, including a fade-away three for the final bucket in his Breslin Center career (shades of Shawn Respert, the original mid-court smoocher, in his Senior Day affair). And Green posted a very productive line considering he played just 16 minutes: 12 points on 5 FGA, 8 rebounds 5 assists.
Durrell Summers never really got going offensively, but he did play aggressively on both ends throughout the game, and scored a twisting fast-break layup late in the game off a pass from Lucas. The cascade of applause Summers got from the Breslin crowd as he departed the game was, I thought, a really wonderful moment.
All in all, the team and the crowd got just about everything they could have hoped for on Senior Night (no highlight moment for Mike Kebler, unfortunately). This was a 71-possession game, so the MSU offense was in high gear for most of the night. 85 points is the highest MSU total since the Prairie View A&M game in mid-December.
The defensive numbers were OK, although I think they probably don't tell the whole story. For once, an opponent was stone cold from three-point range as Iowa shot 0-12 from beyond the arc. Equalize the 3-point shooting (MSU was 7-14) and this would have been a close game. MSU's interior defense, meanwhile, suffered a number of breakdowns, as the Hawkeyes shot 52.2% on 2-pointers, led by Melsahn Besabe (6-9) and Jarryd Cole (4-7).
Otherwise, the four-factor numbers were pretty even, as both teams avoided large amounts of turnovers, rebounded at non-deviated levels, and got to the free throw line once, like, every 15 seconds. MSU wasn't quite as dominant as we might like to see them against the last-place team in the league, but at this point in the season, we're in no position to quibble over the details of a double-digit win.
Bigger picture, this is one more step toward solidifying an NCAA bid. It's entirely possible the team would make the tournament even if it lost its next two games. A win on Saturday (2:00, CBS) in what stands to be the biggest MSU-UM basketball game in recent memory would leave no doubt. (Nonrosy scenario: A loss to Michigan, with Illinois and/or Penn State also winning this weekend, would bump MSU out of the top five and create the possibility of a bad loss in the opening round of the Big Ten Tournament and a significantly-tougher match-up if the team advances to Friday.)
Closing factoid: Tonight's win means that MSU will have finished with at least a .500 record in Big Ten regular season play for the 18th consecutive season (the final two under Jud Heathcote and all 16 under Tom Izzo). It sucks to be on the floor, but it sure is nice that the floor is as high as it is.
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We saw the future of this program tonight.
The Appling, Nix and Payne trio will be very fun to watch over the next few years.
Agreed
I think next year, if we get our young guys situated, could suprise us too. If Dawson and Trice, probably our most immediate contributors of the four, and Byrd can give us solid quality time we’ve got something. One interesting thing will be to see how Thorntons role adjusts too, since most his minutes come from a lack of guards. I like Thornton but I doubt Izzo will sacrifice crucial development of a player like Kearney or Anderson just to play AT. Also where will Alex Gauna fit in what with out amazingly deep front line?
This season is winding down, but the whirlwind sure isn’t going to stop anytime soon
IMO...
Appling & Nix is a comfort zone duo that will begin t obring out the better qualities in Nix, AT will get Kebler like minutes albeit in more of a shooting/rebounding role than a defense role, Trice will get the opportunity to play serious point guard minutes before the midpoint in the season, Dawson will be able to step in and start before conference play, Gauna will be a solid 2 deep PF that will help allow us to spell Roe in an effective manner, if Sherman doesn’t improve over the summe I fear a lot of his minutes will go to AG. Byrd will get a shot to prove his role as sniper and oversized shooting guard, Anderson may get redshirted, Kearney will get minutes all over the backcourt, and Draymond will be relegated to playing PF the whole season without the SF experiment that took place this season and exposed DAYDAYs lateral capabilities. I think we actually finish with a better record next season, partly due to schedule and partly due to the tenacity I think next years squad will have from day 1. Not as high of expectations as this years group, and a lack of experience in a lot of our young but talented core, will keep us from getting preseason hyped like that other school down the road. GO GREEN!
With Green, Roe, Payne, Dawson, Sherman, and Gauna all in the frontcourt mix
Nix is essentially beginning his audition for PT next year right now. Nice to see him taking advantage.
Tonight’s win means that MSU will have finished with at least a .500 record in Big Ten regular season play for the 18th consecutive season
That’s amazing.
PP-TPW.
The Only Colors
Yes it is
Does anyone know how that ranks against the other teams? Also, is there a database site out there with stats that go back more than 10-15 years? I search and I cannot find.
luttez pour les seuls couleurs, vert et blanc
by vert_et_blanc on Mar 3, 2011 9:46 AM CST up reply actions
Ducking Delvon?
This sounds like your kind of mission. I think it must be tops, though, as the only likely contender, Wisconsin, had a 3-13 season back in 97-98, I think.
Relieved!
I would have accepted the mission of tracking down that info, but I’m very glad someone else already has. That would have taken some work.
"You can look at the dinosaur that weighs you down or you can look at the big pot of gold (and) try to say, 'You know what? I'm going to try to live up to expectations.' " -Tom Izzo, Iron Mountain Philosopher
by Ducking Delvon on Mar 3, 2011 3:03 PM CST up reply actions
On the second question: no
Statsheet’s data goes back to 1997. That’s the limit to my knowledge.
Would be interesting to see how the 18-year streak matches up with the top teams from other major conferences.
Fight for The Only Colors: Green and White!
by KJ@theonlycolors on Mar 3, 2011 10:15 AM CST up reply actions
Some older stats/win-loss records here
But you’ve probably seen it:
From the Always Great Andy_H on RCMB
That is the second longest streak in Big Ten history, and longest in the modern era. MSU’s last losing season in conference play was 1993 (7-11).
Big Ten – Consecutive .500+ Big Ten Seasons
-————————————————————-
26 – PUR (1920-1945)
18+ – MSU (1994-2011)
16 – PUR (1973-1988)
14 – IND (1971-1984)
13+ – WIS (1999-2011)
13 – IND (1991-2003)
13 – MIC (1921-1933)
13 – WIS (1906-1918)
MSU is also guaranteed of finishing at or above .500 overall for the 23rd consecutive season, which is the third longest streak in Big Ten history. MSU’s last losing season was 1987-88 (10-18).
Big Ten – Consecutive .500+ Overall Seasons
-————————————————————-
33 – IND (1971-2003)
32 – ILL (1929-1960)
23+ – MSU (1989-2011)
23 – PUR (1920-1942)
22 – PUR (1967-1988)
16 – OSU (1978-1993)
by SpartanBoiler on Mar 3, 2011 11:06 AM CST up reply actions
So in 1943
Purdue was above .500 in the Big Ten but below .500 overall. Bet that doesn’t happen very often. I’d love to set the Big Ten record for both of those streaks, and I think the overall one we have a shot at, but 8 more seasons of plus .500 Big Ten ball is a lot.
Story photo updated
More great Senior Night photos here.
Fight for The Only Colors: Green and White!
by KJ@theonlycolors on Mar 3, 2011 8:24 AM CST reply actions
I loved Nix plowing over McCabe. I don’t think I’ve ever seene a freight train/paper cup collision like that in an MSU basketball game.
by SpartanBoiler on Mar 3, 2011 11:14 AM CST up reply actions
summers
i thought he played great. and ive prolly been his, if not harshest, earliest critic here.
he had three or four hard drives to the lane which was quite refreshing to see. at least one was a pump fake then drive to the hole.
if that alley oop connects – o man. i like to see thsoe attempts . would be nice to throw down over novak on saturday.
He hardly played great...
…though it was clearly a better performance than he has had in weeks. His jump shot if awful. His form is completely messed up. What WAS encouraging was he didn’t settle for it, wasn’t standing around waiting to get the ball passed to him.
My favorite play was when he drove to the basket, had a couple Iowa defenders collapse on him, and then he layed it off to sherman for an easy bucket. THAT is what he needs to do more of, especially if his jumper isn’t falling.
et all
if payne ever learns some touch around the rim hes gonna be a freak. he has a hard shot on his little babyhooks. but i am excited for him bnext year. same with nix and appling. hopefully applings legs/lungs get very strong in the off season so he can have shooting nights like that al the time while also locking down on d.
in the right matchup, nix is incredibly effective. he has a good nose aroound the rim, def has good bball sense for the post. unfortunatly a lot of teams have a jujuan johson like athletic center where nix will not be effective against. trimspa baby?
I was wondering...
afte this year, who in the big ten has a center that can even come close to a Jajuan Johnson? Assuming Sullinger enters the draft. But yes, typically the elite teams in the country no longer have a BIG COUNTRY center anymore, it is something closer to an Amare Stoudemire wanna be.
Great to see the seniors go out in style
I was hoping for a comfortable win and we got one. I’m not going to quibble about the four factors not being more dominant. Appling played great. If you had told me Green would only be able to play spot minutes before the game, I would not have expected a 20 point win. Our underclass bigs are starting to grow into their roles and playing well down the stretch. If we can go big against U of M and get it into the post we could dominate there. They really don’t have much size down low. The question will be whether we can stay tight on them on the perimeter going bigger.
Congrats to the seniors. This year may not have gone according to plan but they’ve been here for some special years and will be remembered fondly for 2 Conference titles and 2 Final Fours. One more win and they have a shot an another Final Four (granted, it looks like a looong shot, but there’s still a chance). Lets get revenge on U of M Saturday and remove all doubt about an NCAA bid.
The changing of the guard
Appling and the Hydra played great. Green had too many fouls early. Nice to see Kalin & Durrell smiling. On to Breslin East.
As a glass-half-empty kind of guy
This game left me feeling a little uneasy. The term ‘rout’ is being used a lot in the area papers today and it didn’t really feel like one to me. Iowa got 15 layups or dunks, same as in the first game. That’s not quite as bad as it sounds, since this was a much faster game (71 poss. vs. 62), but they never could keep Cartwright away from the rim. That spells trouble with Morris and Hardaway Jr. on deck. If Iowa hits even their next-to-last in conference percentage of three-pointers this game is a lot tighter. (Iowa was so terrible beyond the arc that they lost three points off their team 3-point percentage to go under 30% in conference. Ugh. But we’re not last any more!) With Green playing limited minutes the rebounding was also unimpressive. I hope we get good news about his ankle.
OK, now that I’ve got that out of my system I’ll say that it was a great senior night. I’m glad Lucas and company got a chance for a proper send-off. I felt bad for Talor Battle and the most senior-laden team in the conference that the schedulers gave them OSU on their senior night. Glad Lucas, Summers and Kebler were able to go out in style.
I'm being a pessimist
But why do we run screen-roll after screen-roll only to have our guards never even consider hitting the rolling player? The two times we executed the screen-roll Payne got an and-1 and Sherman drew a foul. My theory is our guards just do not trust they bigs to make the play. Good things happen when we play inside-out.
Looking ahead to next year, and interested in more details surrounding Lucious/Allen
I’m curious to hear what peoples thoughts are on the outlook for next years team. I’m a little concerned about our depth in the back court. Obviously we have talented players, but in more recent years we’ve had the luxury of tremendous depth which I think we will be missing at the most important position. Thoughts?
Also, I’m interested to hear peoples opinions or knowledge regarding the dismissals of Lucious and Allen. I’m a huge Izzo supporter, but due to a lack of details surrounding both situations, it seems as if Izzo forced them out more for personal reasons/personality conflicts. For anyone to say that our team/program is better off without those 2 players is completely ridiculous. You don’t see too many other top tier programs (which we are/trying to be) kicking players off the team for anything short of a “our hands are tied” scenario from the university. Izzo’s hands certainly were not tied in the case of these 2 players. Thoughts?
Projected Roster:
PG: Keith Appling, Travis Trice
SG: Russell Byrd, Austin Thornton, Brandan Kearney, Dwuan Anderson
F: Draymond Green, Delvon Roe, Branden Dawson, Alex Gauna
C: Derrick Nix, Adreian Payne, Garrick Sherman, Anthony Ianni
We have scrupulously avoided speculating about behind-the-scenes details of the Allen/Lucious situations
Let’s stick to that rule, please.
Fight for The Only Colors: Green and White!
by KJ@theonlycolors on Mar 3, 2011 2:05 PM CST up reply actions
In case I missed it
What was the reasoning behind this rule? This is obviously a very central portion of the dynamic of the team both this year and next year.
I know you want to keep out of the muckslinging, but I’m sure we could discuss this a bit without resorting to that
"It's a trap!"
You are more than welcome to discuss the impact of the dismissals on team dynamics
Any speculation beyond what’s been in published reports regarding why the dismissals occurred is rumor-mongering, and we simply choose not to do that here.
Fight for The Only Colors: Green and White!
by KJ@theonlycolors on Mar 3, 2011 7:18 PM CST up reply actions
Looking at next year's team
There is really only one clear worry. We will have tremendous depth and experience at four of the five spots on the floor. If Russell Byrd is as good a shooter as advertised, Nix and Payne continue their development, and nothing happens to Draymond or Delvon, then I like the 2-5 spots immensely. We will have shooting, rebounding, interior scoring, both perimeter and post defenders, post passers and senior leadership in spades.
The one thing we don’t have a proven supply of is ball handling and perimeter play-makers. In other words, the point guard. The Appling of last night certainly seems capable of that role, but it is hard to require the same player to be your defensive stopper and your offensive play-maker. Much of the success of next year depends on Appling’s stamina, and Trice’s ability to make an immediate impact.
Lucious Allen
I don’t think further explanations are necessary – “violation of team rules” or whatever works for me – but you don’t see many elite teams doing this. I think that’s good for MSU’s image in the long run. However, those were two big holes this year (particularly Allen). There are a lot of “what ifs” in college basketball and this is one of them since this team, as of May 2010, was as deep and as talented as any post-2001 team.
As for next year’s team, the guard positions are very thin. It would have been nice to have Byrd get experience this year instead of having a sophomore, three freshmen, and a former walk-on as your guards. The front court should develop quite a bit and they’ll have to score and rebound a lot more than this year.
by SpartanBoiler on Mar 3, 2011 5:06 PM CST up reply actions
Details will never be released.
Unless Allen or Lucious say something someday. Izzo isn’t going to divulge the details. Suffice it to say that he did it for a good reason(s). Izzo had never dismissed a player in his tenure. Dismissing two key players from the playing group on a team built to do big things tells us what we need to know. There were legitimate reasons for their departures.
by rook34 on Mar 3, 2011 10:23 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
2 records broken/set last night
Kalin Lucas – now 1st place for most career free throws made, passing Paul Davis (who had 477).
Delvon Roe – passes Matt Steigenga for career blocked shots (Roe has 98 now), but Roe is still quite a bit short of 1st place Drew Naymick (134).
If Roe stays on pace, and we make 2 tourney runs....
He will be really close to tie with Maymick or break the record at the end of next season.
McCaffery
I haven’t seen this discussed, and I’m not sure TV would have captured it as it was happening, but from being at the game, it looked like McCaffery was going crazy while the seniors were doing their farewell substitutions. The ref was standing right in front of him, and after Summers went out, and it became clear that we weren’t done yet, he was going ballistic and motioning with his arms with a “HURRY UP!!!” gesture. Again, he might have been yelling about something else, but it looked pretty clear to me that he was pissed about how long it was taking. Seems like most coaches understand the senior night thing and wouldn’t raise much of a fuss about it.
"You can look at the dinosaur that weighs you down or you can look at the big pot of gold (and) try to say, 'You know what? I'm going to try to live up to expectations.' " -Tom Izzo, Iron Mountain Philosopher
If it were a close game, I could see being annoyed if it takes longer than a normal timeout.
Senior night festivities shouldn’t interfere with the game (nor should any ceremonies for things like a guy breaking a record – the Celtics game where Ray Allen broke the career 3-pointers record was interrupted for about 5 minutes for the celebration). But when the outcome is decided (and we wouldn’t be yanking our best player off the court if it weren’t) and it’s the last time they’re going to play in front of the home fans, deal with it. They deserve a proper send-off.
I've got this terrible pain in all the diodes down my left-hand side.
Bradley-Terry rankings for college football and basketball: because there aren't enough computer rankings already.
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